| Joined: Mar 2011 Posts: 1,024 "OCF Kiwi Down Under" Patient Advocate (1000+ posts) | OP "OCF Kiwi Down Under" Patient Advocate (1000+ posts) Joined: Mar 2011 Posts: 1,024 | Kris saw the oral surgeon today. His teeth continue to decay and the time has come for some definitive treatment. HBO is one of our options prior to extraction. However, the oral surgeon mentioned to us that if there is 1 remaining cancer cell, HBO can accelerate growth. Frankly, if this is so I will not let Kris undertake this. Does anyone here know if this is so? I can only find conflicting papers/opinions on this. Thanks in advance for any advice. Tammy
Caregiver/advocate to Husband Kris age 59@ diagnosis DX Dec '10 SCC BOT T4aN2bM0 HPV+ve.Cisplatin x3 35 IMRT. PET 6/11 clear. R) level 2-4 neck dissection 8/1/11 to remove residual node - necrotic with NED Feb '12 Ca back.. 3/8/12 total glossectomy/laryngectomy/bilat neck dissection/partial pharyngectomy etc. clear margins. All nodes negative for disease. PEG in. March 2017 - 5 years disease free. Woohoo!
| | | | Joined: Dec 2010 Posts: 5,264 Likes: 4 "OCF Canuck" Patient Advocate (old timer, 2000 posts) | "OCF Canuck" Patient Advocate (old timer, 2000 posts) Joined: Dec 2010 Posts: 5,264 Likes: 4 | I would think the opposite since most cancers prefer a hypoxic environment. Isn't the premise behind hbo to flush O2 into the area to promote healing. The only connection I could see would be that it likely increases metabolism in the area and circulation - and therefore possibly cancer spread. But if there is one cancer cell there then chances are with or without hbo it will grow. There are many here who've had hbo.
Last edited by Cheryld; 07-17-2013 01:40 AM.
Cheryl : Irritation - 2004 BX: 6/2008 : Inflam. BX: 12/10, DX: 12/10 : SCC - LS tongue well dif. T2N1M0. 2/11 hemigloss + recon. : PND - 40 nodes - 39 clear. 3/11 - 5/11 IMRT 33 + cis x2, PEG 3/28/11 - 5/19/11 3 head, 2 chest scans - clear(fingers crossed) HPV-, No smoke, drink, or drugs, Vegan
| | | | Joined: Jun 2007 Posts: 10,507 Likes: 7 Administrator, Director of Patient Support Services Patient Advocate (old timer, 2000 posts) | Administrator, Director of Patient Support Services Patient Advocate (old timer, 2000 posts) Joined: Jun 2007 Posts: 10,507 Likes: 7 | Yes, you are correct Tammy.
Cheryl is also right about But if there is one cancer cell there then chances are with or without hbo it will grow.
Cancer loves oxygen and thats what HBO is, pressurized pure oxygen. I dont know exactly where I got this info from, I cant remember reading any studies about it. Im sorry, I wish I had a study to refer you to so you would be able to make a decision.
One thing I do know for certain, ORN can be brutally painful. Plus it will only spread as time goes on if left untreated. This is what our pal EzJim has gone thru over the past couple years. He was not able to do HBO due to other medical issues and HBO is what he needed to do for his bad jaw. Poor guy is in alot of pain for years and I just dont know how he is able to manage it on a daily basis. Recently, Ive had my own ORN issues and surgeries that I havent discussed here. At this time my situation has been corrected.
I would discuss this with any other doctors who are familiar with HBO, like an ENT or the oncology docs.
Best wishes, please let us know how you make out. ChristineSCC 6/15/07 L chk & by L molar both Stag I, age44 2x cispltn-35 IMRT end 9/27/07 -65 lbs in 2 mo, no caregvr Clear PET 1/08 4/4/08 recur L chk Stag I surg 4/16/08 clr marg 215 HBO dives 3/09 teeth out, trismus 7/2/09 recur, Stg IV 8/24/09 trach, ND, mandiblctmy 3wks medicly inducd coma 2 mo xtended hospital stay, ICU & burn unit PICC line IV antibx 8 mo 10/4/10, 2/14/11 reconst surg OC 3x in 3 years very happy to be alive | | | | Joined: Dec 2003 Posts: 2,606 Likes: 2 Patient Advocate (old timer, 2000 posts) | Patient Advocate (old timer, 2000 posts) Joined: Dec 2003 Posts: 2,606 Likes: 2 | A few studies have indicated it can further tumor growth but some studies have shown it actually hinders the angiogenesis process by exerting pressure on the arterioles or capillaries feeding the tumor. One important finding is the HBOT oxygenates the tumor and improves radiotherapy efficacy. I don't know if anyone can clearly say it hurts more than it helps as every person is different as in all other treatment modalities.
SCC Stage IV, BOT, T2N2bM0 Cisplatin/5FU x 3, 40 days radiation Diagnosis 07/21/03 tx completed 10/08/03 Post Radiation Lower Motor Neuron Syndrome 3/08. Cervical Spinal Stenosis 01/11 Cervical Myelitis 09/12 Thoracic Paraplegia 10/12 Dysautonomia 11/12 Hospice care 09/12-01/13. COPD 01/14 Intermittent CHF 6/15 Feeding tube NPO 03/16 VFI 12/2016 ORN 12/2017 Cardiac Event 06/2018 Bilateral VFI 01/2021 Thoracotomy Bilobectomy 01/2022 Bilateral VFI 05/2022 Total Laryngectomy 01/2023
| | | | Joined: Jul 2012 Posts: 3,267 Likes: 4 Patient Advocate (old timer, 2000 posts) | Patient Advocate (old timer, 2000 posts) Joined: Jul 2012 Posts: 3,267 Likes: 4 | I looked into the hypoxia matter, as Cheyrl mentioned, being anemic, and possibly chemo and and radio resistant due to the multiple recurrnces. The old theory is oxygen feeds cancer, but in agreement with Ed with angeogenesis which makes the tumor, and new area for blood supply, hypoxic, and so cancer thrives in low oxygen they now say. They did studies with HBOT, to inprove hypoxia for radiation, but there was no real benefit in some, some say it did or did not cause any negeative effects, They have a few meds that are or were used that had more benefit, forget names. Oxygen may have an effect during surgery, with the oxygen pressure levels on the tumor itself, which I can't fully explain, understand, that can increase tumor growth, if it's not the correct levels.
I had 30 HBOT treatments for an extraction 4 months after radiation, two months before a recurrence. It's a good question to ask your RO, and the dr with HBOT, who may be a wound management, that may have more knowledge about this.
Last edited by PaulB; 07-17-2013 12:30 PM.
10/09 T1N2bM0 Tonsil 11/09 Taxo Cisp 5-FU, 6 Months Hosp 01/11 35 IMRT 70Gy 7 Wks 06/11 30 HBO 08/11 RND PNI 06/12 SND PNI LVI 08/12 RND Pec Flap IORT 12 Gy 10/12 25 IMRT 50Gy 6 Wks Taxo Erbitux 10/13 SND 10/13 TBO/Angiograph 10/13 RND Carotid Remove IORT 10Gy PNI 12/13 25 Protons 50Gy 6 Wks Carbo 11/14 All Teeth Extract 30 HBO 03/15 Sequestromy Buccal Flap ORN 09/16 Mandibulectomy Fib Flap Sternotomy 04/17 Regraft hypergranulation Donor Site 06/17 Heart Attack Stent 02/19 Finally Cancer Free Took 10 yrs
| | | | Joined: Jun 2007 Posts: 10,507 Likes: 7 Administrator, Director of Patient Support Services Patient Advocate (old timer, 2000 posts) | Administrator, Director of Patient Support Services Patient Advocate (old timer, 2000 posts) Joined: Jun 2007 Posts: 10,507 Likes: 7 | Thanks Ed and Paul! This is an interesting subject to me as Ive done way more HBO than I care to count and Ive also had OC 3 times. I was thinking of checking with some wound care specialists that I know but then I thought its kinda like asking a surgeon if they would recommend surgery.
Tammy if you (or anyone else) finds any studies that have been done on this please post for all of us to learn from.
Thanks! ChristineSCC 6/15/07 L chk & by L molar both Stag I, age44 2x cispltn-35 IMRT end 9/27/07 -65 lbs in 2 mo, no caregvr Clear PET 1/08 4/4/08 recur L chk Stag I surg 4/16/08 clr marg 215 HBO dives 3/09 teeth out, trismus 7/2/09 recur, Stg IV 8/24/09 trach, ND, mandiblctmy 3wks medicly inducd coma 2 mo xtended hospital stay, ICU & burn unit PICC line IV antibx 8 mo 10/4/10, 2/14/11 reconst surg OC 3x in 3 years very happy to be alive | | | | Joined: Mar 2011 Posts: 1,024 "OCF Kiwi Down Under" Patient Advocate (1000+ posts) | OP "OCF Kiwi Down Under" Patient Advocate (1000+ posts) Joined: Mar 2011 Posts: 1,024 | I have found the following 2 articles this morning. Both state HBO is safe to use when patients have previously been diagnosed with cancer and that HBO does not enhance tumour growth. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23054400http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18281803However Kris is keen on the alternative option we were given. That is to do Root Canals on the teeth, leave a dressing on and then cap the tooth. If he was 5 years out I would encourage him to do the HBO, but I still have lingering doubts. I feel this root canal option will buy him time and then when he gets to the magical dreamed of 5 year mark we can look at HBO. Thoughts? Tammy
Caregiver/advocate to Husband Kris age 59@ diagnosis DX Dec '10 SCC BOT T4aN2bM0 HPV+ve.Cisplatin x3 35 IMRT. PET 6/11 clear. R) level 2-4 neck dissection 8/1/11 to remove residual node - necrotic with NED Feb '12 Ca back.. 3/8/12 total glossectomy/laryngectomy/bilat neck dissection/partial pharyngectomy etc. clear margins. All nodes negative for disease. PEG in. March 2017 - 5 years disease free. Woohoo!
| | | | Joined: Jul 2012 Posts: 3,267 Likes: 4 Patient Advocate (old timer, 2000 posts) | Patient Advocate (old timer, 2000 posts) Joined: Jul 2012 Posts: 3,267 Likes: 4 | Thanks for the links. I had several root canals, post treatment, and did not need HBOT either.
10/09 T1N2bM0 Tonsil 11/09 Taxo Cisp 5-FU, 6 Months Hosp 01/11 35 IMRT 70Gy 7 Wks 06/11 30 HBO 08/11 RND PNI 06/12 SND PNI LVI 08/12 RND Pec Flap IORT 12 Gy 10/12 25 IMRT 50Gy 6 Wks Taxo Erbitux 10/13 SND 10/13 TBO/Angiograph 10/13 RND Carotid Remove IORT 10Gy PNI 12/13 25 Protons 50Gy 6 Wks Carbo 11/14 All Teeth Extract 30 HBO 03/15 Sequestromy Buccal Flap ORN 09/16 Mandibulectomy Fib Flap Sternotomy 04/17 Regraft hypergranulation Donor Site 06/17 Heart Attack Stent 02/19 Finally Cancer Free Took 10 yrs
| | | | Joined: Dec 2003 Posts: 2,606 Likes: 2 Patient Advocate (old timer, 2000 posts) | Patient Advocate (old timer, 2000 posts) Joined: Dec 2003 Posts: 2,606 Likes: 2 | Here is a link with many studies cited if you want to dig deeper. HBO Study
Last edited by ChristineB; 07-18-2013 11:06 AM. Reason: fix link
SCC Stage IV, BOT, T2N2bM0 Cisplatin/5FU x 3, 40 days radiation Diagnosis 07/21/03 tx completed 10/08/03 Post Radiation Lower Motor Neuron Syndrome 3/08. Cervical Spinal Stenosis 01/11 Cervical Myelitis 09/12 Thoracic Paraplegia 10/12 Dysautonomia 11/12 Hospice care 09/12-01/13. COPD 01/14 Intermittent CHF 6/15 Feeding tube NPO 03/16 VFI 12/2016 ORN 12/2017 Cardiac Event 06/2018 Bilateral VFI 01/2021 Thoracotomy Bilobectomy 01/2022 Bilateral VFI 05/2022 Total Laryngectomy 01/2023
| | | | Joined: Jun 2007 Posts: 10,507 Likes: 7 Administrator, Director of Patient Support Services Patient Advocate (old timer, 2000 posts) | Administrator, Director of Patient Support Services Patient Advocate (old timer, 2000 posts) Joined: Jun 2007 Posts: 10,507 Likes: 7 | ChristineSCC 6/15/07 L chk & by L molar both Stag I, age44 2x cispltn-35 IMRT end 9/27/07 -65 lbs in 2 mo, no caregvr Clear PET 1/08 4/4/08 recur L chk Stag I surg 4/16/08 clr marg 215 HBO dives 3/09 teeth out, trismus 7/2/09 recur, Stg IV 8/24/09 trach, ND, mandiblctmy 3wks medicly inducd coma 2 mo xtended hospital stay, ICU & burn unit PICC line IV antibx 8 mo 10/4/10, 2/14/11 reconst surg OC 3x in 3 years very happy to be alive | | |
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