| Joined: Feb 2013 Posts: 7 "OCF across the pond" Member | OP "OCF across the pond" Member Joined: Feb 2013 Posts: 7 | Hi everyone, thank you for your help so far regarding post radiotherapy foods. Another problem that someone may be able to help us with is the question of saliva. My husband either has too much - usually thick and sticky - or a completely dry mouth. Is it something he is eating or even not eating. Any advice will be gratefully accepted. | | | | Joined: Oct 2012 Posts: 1,275 Likes: 7 Assistant Admin Patient Advocate (1000+ posts) | Assistant Admin Patient Advocate (1000+ posts) Joined: Oct 2012 Posts: 1,275 Likes: 7 | As far as I understand, the saliva problem has nothing to do with food. The salivary glands in the cheeks are the ones are fried first after radiation, so the amount of saliva is reduced. Then, there are glands under the jaw that produce the mucous, these go later, but in the meantime, they cause the mucous to be really thick and ropey. These are the side effects of radiation. If the mucous is thick and ropey, get your husband to rinse with the baking soda mixture or flat club soda. These cut the mucous and make it easier for him to spit it out. For dry mouth, some people use Biotene mouthwash. (It may be available under another brand name in the UK.) We have also followed the advice we got on this forum and bought a Water Pik. Put a little mucositis mouthwash in the water tank. Use the tongue scraper attachment on a low setting. It will also clear out the ropey saliva.
Gloria She stood in the storm, and when the wind did not blow her way, she adjusted her sails... Elizabeth Edwards
Wife to John,dx 10/2012, BOT, HPV+, T3N2MO, RAD 70 gy,Cisplatinx2 , PEG in Dec 6, 2012, dx dvt in both legs after second chemo session, Apr 03/13 NED, July 2013 met to lungs, Phase 1 immunotherapy trial Jan 18/14 to July/14. Taxol/carboplatin July/14. Esophagus re-opened Oct 14. PEG out April 8, 2015. Phase 2 trial of Selinexor April to July 2015. At peace Jan 15, 2016. | | | | Joined: Feb 2013 Posts: 7 "OCF across the pond" Member | OP "OCF across the pond" Member Joined: Feb 2013 Posts: 7 | Thank you for your help, will give your advice a try and let you know. Just trying the flat soda and will have a look in the Internet for the water pik. We have various mouthwashes given by the hospital which Dave uses everyday. I expect like everything else it will be a long process. At least it isn't what I'm making him eatI. Thank you again for replying. | | | | Joined: Jul 2012 Posts: 3,267 Likes: 4 Patient Advocate (old timer, 2000 posts) | Patient Advocate (old timer, 2000 posts) Joined: Jul 2012 Posts: 3,267 Likes: 4 | Radiation destroys only thin saliva, which is what the parotid gland only produces. The others produce a mixture, of thin and thick saliva, but mostly thick, so that is why you have thick, ropey saliva, , which may have a yellow tinge. Sometimes the parotid gland is spared by IMRT treatment, reduced dosage, and damage depends on the total Gy. Permanent damage occurs when it's over 30Gy. Under this amount the parotid gland will slowly start producing saliva over time. Even if totally destroyed, the other glands may try and compensate by producing more. Also, some patients only have ipsilateral radiation, one side, not bilaterally, so their saliva production will be better. I had bilateral radiation.
Other things for thick, ropey mucus. In addition to the above:
Use a humidifier Sleep on an incline Robitussm Mucinex Rinsing with pineapple or papaya juice Rinsing with the above juice with seltzer Rinsing with meat tenderized mixed with water Ginger tea Using an aspirator machine, suction machine Brushing, rinsing often Pre moistened Sponge brushes on sticks to get in back area
I hope this helps.
10/09 T1N2bM0 Tonsil 11/09 Taxo Cisp 5-FU, 6 Months Hosp 01/11 35 IMRT 70Gy 7 Wks 06/11 30 HBO 08/11 RND PNI 06/12 SND PNI LVI 08/12 RND Pec Flap IORT 12 Gy 10/12 25 IMRT 50Gy 6 Wks Taxo Erbitux 10/13 SND 10/13 TBO/Angiograph 10/13 RND Carotid Remove IORT 10Gy PNI 12/13 25 Protons 50Gy 6 Wks Carbo 11/14 All Teeth Extract 30 HBO 03/15 Sequestromy Buccal Flap ORN 09/16 Mandibulectomy Fib Flap Sternotomy 04/17 Regraft hypergranulation Donor Site 06/17 Heart Attack Stent 02/19 Finally Cancer Free Took 10 yrs
| | | | Joined: Feb 2013 Posts: 7 "OCF across the pond" Member | OP "OCF across the pond" Member Joined: Feb 2013 Posts: 7 | Thank you, yes, very helpful. You have so much knowledge and I am learning all the time. Thanks again. | | | | Joined: Jul 2012 Posts: 3,267 Likes: 4 Patient Advocate (old timer, 2000 posts) | Patient Advocate (old timer, 2000 posts) Joined: Jul 2012 Posts: 3,267 Likes: 4 | I'm still learning too, I didn't even know who an oncologist was three years ago, let alone an ENT hopefully your education is short, quick, and able to graduate to do other things of choice in life. Good luck.
10/09 T1N2bM0 Tonsil 11/09 Taxo Cisp 5-FU, 6 Months Hosp 01/11 35 IMRT 70Gy 7 Wks 06/11 30 HBO 08/11 RND PNI 06/12 SND PNI LVI 08/12 RND Pec Flap IORT 12 Gy 10/12 25 IMRT 50Gy 6 Wks Taxo Erbitux 10/13 SND 10/13 TBO/Angiograph 10/13 RND Carotid Remove IORT 10Gy PNI 12/13 25 Protons 50Gy 6 Wks Carbo 11/14 All Teeth Extract 30 HBO 03/15 Sequestromy Buccal Flap ORN 09/16 Mandibulectomy Fib Flap Sternotomy 04/17 Regraft hypergranulation Donor Site 06/17 Heart Attack Stent 02/19 Finally Cancer Free Took 10 yrs
| | | | Joined: Oct 2012 Posts: 1,275 Likes: 7 Assistant Admin Patient Advocate (1000+ posts) | Assistant Admin Patient Advocate (1000+ posts) Joined: Oct 2012 Posts: 1,275 Likes: 7 | Paul, you ARE truly knowledgeable. I have learned so much from your postings.
Gloria She stood in the storm, and when the wind did not blow her way, she adjusted her sails... Elizabeth Edwards
Wife to John,dx 10/2012, BOT, HPV+, T3N2MO, RAD 70 gy,Cisplatinx2 , PEG in Dec 6, 2012, dx dvt in both legs after second chemo session, Apr 03/13 NED, July 2013 met to lungs, Phase 1 immunotherapy trial Jan 18/14 to July/14. Taxol/carboplatin July/14. Esophagus re-opened Oct 14. PEG out April 8, 2015. Phase 2 trial of Selinexor April to July 2015. At peace Jan 15, 2016. | | | | Joined: Dec 2010 Posts: 5,260 Likes: 3 "OCF Canuck" Patient Advocate (old timer, 2000 posts) | "OCF Canuck" Patient Advocate (old timer, 2000 posts) Joined: Dec 2010 Posts: 5,260 Likes: 3 | ;o) I use a waterpik to clean up the guk as well. I loved it during treatment as it cleaned my mouth and got rid of the worst stuff. Fizzy stuff, and juices are often painful and burn, post radiation, but luke warm water, (you can add the baking soda mixture or flattened club soda instead of just water)in the water chamber, on the lowest setting, cleans, helps heal, and breaks up the mucous. It will take time to see if your hubby's glands kick in and start producing saliva. It depends on the path of the radiation and any surgeries. I am okay at this point. I am dry in the morning, but during the day I'm okay - it has taken a while to get to this point. When the guk goes away - which it will - and dry mouth sets in, Biotene toothpaste, and gel helps. There are also a few meds that apparently are hit or miss.
best of luck.
Cheryl : Irritation - 2004 BX: 6/2008 : Inflam. BX: 12/10, DX: 12/10 : SCC - LS tongue well dif. T2N1M0. 2/11 hemigloss + recon. : PND - 40 nodes - 39 clear. 3/11 - 5/11 IMRT 33 + cis x2, PEG 3/28/11 - 5/19/11 3 head, 2 chest scans - clear(fingers crossed) HPV-, No smoke, drink, or drugs, Vegan
| | | | Joined: Jan 2013 Posts: 1,292 Likes: 1 Patient Advocate (1000+ posts) | Patient Advocate (1000+ posts) Joined: Jan 2013 Posts: 1,292 Likes: 1 | Hi Cheryl,
I too now use waterpik religiously couple times a day. Many folks get nasty build up on the tongue. My kit has this tongue scraping thing that directs the jet onto the tongue while you scrape. Have you heard how well this attachment works in our day to day lives? don
Don Male, 57 - Great health except C Dec '12 DX: BOT SCC T2N2bMx, Stage 4a, HPV+, multiple nodes 1 tooth out Jan '13 2nd tooth out Tumor Board -induction TPF (3 cycles), seq CRT 4-6/2013 CRT 70gr 2x35, weekly carbo150 ended 5/29,6/4 All the details, join at http://beatdown.cognacom.com | | | | Joined: Dec 2012 Posts: 26 Contributing Member (25+ posts) | Contributing Member (25+ posts) Joined: Dec 2012 Posts: 26 | I couldn't use the waterpik early on because my mouth was so sore. The mouth now four months since radiation is better but the thick mucous still persists. I use a soft toothbrush to get it off the tongue and the roof of my mouth. I have to so this many time during the day. If I talk alot the mucouc turns to a thick foamy mess. Being that I have also lost my swallowing function I have to have a place to spit. At night I dry out pretty much so I use a vaporizer and "breath rite" strips on my nose to allow better breathing thru my nostrils instead of my mouth.
Mr Mike
WM age 69, Stage III sqamous cell, base of tongue (left lingual tonsil), (1) node positive, Dxd Aug 2012, 35 rad treat with Cisplatin weekly, final treatment 10-16-12, CT scan 11-18-12 good result, PET in Jan 2013, good result, Barium swallow test...no swallowing function.
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