Being a Christian for quite some I too have to agree with Brian. We have to do ALL that we can do first before we ask God to do what He can do.
And that covers a lot of bases - stopping the addictive behaviour (if that was involved), seeking the best doctors and institutions, getting educated and being a self advocate for the best treatment choices.

I prayed a lot and still do but that didn't mean not to go the distance to find every available weapon in the fight. God works through people and that includes doctors and institutions.

I am not religious but has no offence against any religion. I agree that Christians are very supportive and when I was in the darkest part of the tunnel, my Christian friends prayed a lot for me and when I started to recover, they claimed that I could be cured because of their constant prayers. I wonder if I didn't make any effort and just sat back and waited for God's help, would the outcome be the same? Would I still be alive if I weren't proactive enough in grasping the essential weapons to fight the battle? Of course many patients who were fervent in their religion and had a courageous fighting spirit still lost their battle. I can only say that since we are human, there are many things beyond our power and control to manage.


Karen.

The posting regarding there is no smoking gun related to spit tobacco was deleted by me, and that is why you will not find it in that thread any longer. The information was just completely incorrect. There is a direct link between oral cancer and spit tobacco and just because this posters relatives were able to live to ripe old ages and still use tobacco, doesn't mean that that applies to everyone. We all know that different genetic make ups make each one of us susceptible or not to different diseases, be they cancer, heart, or others. George Burns smoked cigars into his 80's (quit for the last 15 years of his life and never got cancer. ) But he was an anomaly not the normal person in the tobacco experience. I can't spend my days arguing with a particular poster about the information or some superficial point that thousands of peer reviewed published articles corroborate. So at times it is just easier to remove the incorrect information. Occasionally I edit a post and that leaves behind an included trail which states that OCF edited the post for content. But there was nothing in the post to salvage, it was total bunk. Sorry to be so blunt, but a spade is a spade. If you don't have the right information from a reliable source, you can only speak from your personal experience and that may be different than others experiences. That is ok to post, but to blatantly say there is no connection (

Brian,

This is not a hijack, I'm looking a few posts up from yours. This seems as good a place as any to add my thoughts on the religion issue as it relates to the board.

All,

Oh boy, here I go into the abyss. I'm going to jump in with my thoughts on the religious overtone that seems to have overtaken the site. I accept peoples spirituality for what it is. I was raised as, and continue to be, a christian. I am not deeply religious and, I'll admit, praying is usually an act of desperation on my part. I understand the comfort people derive from prayer and fully appreciate that countless people include me in theirs. I just think the place, at first glance, is starting to appear a bit Christian based. We are not talking religious, we are talking strictly Christian. I know I am not the only one that feels this way and I have exchanged emails on this matter with several members. The old standard was one of common sense. The tone of the initial post would dictate the response. Brian probably got tired of writing that. Anyway, this is not the only cancer board I am involved with but it is the one I hold closest to my heart. I have been here a long time (thank God) and many of you are like family to me. Initially I was drawn to this site by the seemingly endless resources. What a wealth of information and knowledge! I stay to offer my insights and, ass I said, we are a family. I worry that we occasionally drift too far from the reasons most of us first came here, and that the Christian spin could inadvertently send I newcomer away. Religion has a place here, but it should not permeate every post. Just a thought.

On a lighter note, I am into my 3rd of 6 weeks of radiation for NSCLC and doing great. Tomorrow I go to Yale for my 2 year 4 month check-up.

Glenn

Glenn - good luck on your check up, they always make me tense and nervous before each one, and try as I may, I never can seem to control that. The nature of survivorship I suppose.

As to the religion issue I tend to agree with you and I do not wear my religious beliefs on my sleeve. To me religion is a private matter, and my spirituality is not something that I share with others openly. The general rule about religion on the boards has been stated when you sign up: http://www.oralcancerfoundation.org/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?/ubb/agree_review.html

In it nutshell it says: Read the original post. If that person expressed something like pray for me etc., then a reply that also includes reference to prayer is more than appropriate. If that first poster does not make a reference to religion, the following posts should refrain from it as well. It's a simple thing that will keep the board balanced and not exclude any ideas. Strong religious beliefs have helped many a person through difficult times, and cancer certainly qualifies as one. But as we post answers and inspiration to others here, we must always remember that OUR religion may not be THEIR religion, or they may not be religious at all. Clearly, there are no absolutes here. The rule of thumb is not to make assumptions about other's belief systems, and offer the most valuable thing that you have

"I stay to offer my insights and, ass I said, we are a family."

Typo or Devine providence? You decide.

Seriously folks, I have to agree with Glenn's observation here. I am speaking from a Christian upbringing and as an active member of my church. Faith is and will be an important part of many people dealing with a potentially fatal disease. That does not mean, in my opinion, that we should waive our particular faith in front of others. It is outside the purpose of this support forum to attempt to influence anyone

I completely agree (especially Glenn {my alter ego ha ha}) with all of you. Sometimes the religious element does get a little over the top here and like Mark, I too am active in my church and am involved in several different ministries. I think that Brian's approach to it is very fair and balanced. We do need to approach this in a manner that reaches the largest common denominator. AA has been successful at this for over 60 years now. Religion can really put some people off -some, understandably, even blame God for this. We all need to be sensitive to this.

We all owe Scott an apology for hijacking his thread.