I just want to add that the flu shot still as an exceedingly low side effect rate, and the benefits of it usually outweigh the risks....

even with the flu shot, a new study shows it is ineffective for most seniors over 70 and that is who they advertise to the most...

i am not anti shot for the most part dont get me wrong but i am not for every one they push just because they push it

i just wish i would have investigated on my own about gardasil before i told my daughter to get it ... but too late now - just hope the effects she has had are not long term

when my daughter had problems with it and we went to report it they would not even accept the report - said it was not one of the listed side effects of the drug ... yet a forum like this one showed tons of gals saying the same things happened to them after having the shot and they were looking for answers too ...

anyways i am just saying look into things before choosing them - i am not saying dont do it - that is up to each to decide ...

$366 per shot is the price of gardasil and you have to get three of them. it is reported to be more expensive than all childhood immunizations put together.

- and when i said 18 deaths i just noted on cdc.gov there have been 27 reports now ... but they dismiss them for the most part being excused for other reasons ... because there wasn't a common pattern ... except all had had the shot ...

while my thoughts may not be well documented in these postings due to not wanting to make a dauntingly long post on something off topic, i was merely meaning to make a mention of it to david because of his mention of the shot ...... my thoughts on the matter are nor sparse or scatterbrained because i did a lot of investigating into it when my daughter had the problems she did because it got downright scary. my sources were not internet scare sites they were real people having real problems, and medical field documented cases and TV and Newspaper reports.

anyways - not wanting to make waves - and like i said, it is up to each to decide for themself, far beit from me to tell anyone what to do or not do ... i was simply sharing what i had learned after telling my daughter i thought it was a good idea.

one more point so we have correct info - there are 15 high risk forms of the HPV virus which can cause cancer... 16, 18, 31,33,35,39,45,51,52,56,58,59,68,73 & 82. and then another 15 of them are possibly related to cancer.... but 16 18 and 31 are the only ones most people hear of...


*see wikpedia*

I just pulled this off the CDC site this morning:

"Safety of the HPV vaccine
This vaccine has been licensed by the FDA and approved by CDC as safe and effective. It was studied in thousands of females (ages 9 through 26 years) around the world and its safety continues to be monitored by CDC and the FDA. Studies have found no serious side effects. The most common side effect is soreness in the arm (where the shot is given). There have recently been some reports of fainting in teens after they got the vaccine. For this reason, it is recommended that patients wait in their doctor�s office for 15 minutes after getting the vaccine.


Cost and Paying for the HPV vaccine
The retail price of the vaccine is about $125 per dose ($375 for full series)."

There was no data on serious adverse effcts or Medwatch reports on the FDA website. See: http://www.fda.gov/cber/products/gardasil.htm

Also: http://www.fda.gov/cder/drug/DrugSafety/DrugIndex.htm

I am not surprised that there is much mis-information about this drug because of far right religious concerns. Conversely almost all drugs, even OTC can have adverse effects.

Further complicating the adverse effects data is the fact that it's possible that the adverse effect may not even be related to the medication. FDA guidelines are that ALL adverse effects must be reported whether or not proven to be related to the medication.

It's effect is to make it almost impossible for the average patient to sort out what is a legitimate concern or a rare or even unrelated anomaly. That's why oftentimes, a consult with the pharmacist is a good idea.

Ambulance chasers love this and play on the emotional, political and religious aspects, (and the general distrust of pharmaceutical companies) you are bound to have to make a controversial decision.

The ultimate decision here has to be guided by risk/benefit like all decisions for medical intervention.

I noticed that when I Googled side effects, there were a number of legal sites trolling for people's reports -- That usually indicates to me that there's a major disconnect between perceptions and reality.

Thanks gary - i agree when something is new it is kind of a wait and see because there will be real info and false info in the beginning, so one has to decide for themself on that risk benefit scale.

i would like to know where you found it listed for $125 a shot though because they charged us $366 for each one not 125 and that was not for the doctor visit (wasn't even the doc who gave it but wanted to make it clear that it was not the doctors bill but the bill for the shot itself)

have a good one

The problem with a wait and see attitude about HPV, is that it is a very commonly acquired, sexually transmitted virus. The CDC says that in their lifetimes, 80% of the entire (300million) American population will have had or have some version of it. Since the vaccine only works if you have NOT BEEN EXPOSED to the virus, then waiting until a child becomes sexually active greatly diminishes the odds that it will be effective in them, as they likely will have encountered the virus already, negating the positive of the vaccine and making it useless.

Here are some questions that you should ask yourself. When you have answers to them, please compare them to the risks of this shot. Post them here so that everyone can have a frame of reference.

How many kids die from a bee sting in the US each year? Is their any way, before you take your child to the park for the first time in their young lives, that you can know if they are one of the few that will have a catastrophic event associated with being stung? If there is a way to know, did you do it?

How many people died from the polio vaccine, or had an extreme adverse reaction to it? Compare that with the Guardasil numbers. And this is the most successful vaccine ever produced. Nobel prizes given for its discovery.

How many children die in the US each year from an anaphylactic reaction to peanuts? Is there any way that you can find out they are going to have this happen before you give them their first PB and J? If there is a way to know, did you do it?

How many individuals spontaneously die before the age of 25 with no known risk factors, like a heart issue or the like? How many do we have the opportunity to prevent?

When you know the answers to these questions please post them here. I am not going to do this exercise for you, though I know the answers. But what I want people to get out of it, is to learn, and to be able to evaluate for themselves, the lesson of proportionate thinking and risk taking. I bet you took your daughter to the park without knowing the answer to the bee question. I bet she also had her first PB and J without you knowing that either. This doesn't make you a bad person, It makes you normal. So why be driven by a minority, alarmist, heard mentality on an equally important subject?

Lastly your list of the HPV's that cause cancer is not correct. There are some in that list that have been associated with cancers, but as a synergistic sub-type, and not the causative agent. So the list isn't actually as long as you make it seem. There is a difference between those that produce direct oncoproteins that change a cell, and those occasionally are found in synergy in cells where a primary known oncogenic HPV has done the damage. More so, THIS IS IMPORTANT - oncogenic HPV's are site specific. If you looked at a peer reviewed paper, and there are some benchmark ones in the New England Journal of Medicine, that talks about oncogenic HPV's as they have been researched in cervical cancer, most of them are not found in oral, anal, penis, or other cancer sites associated with HPV. So the question is, what is important to THIS group of oral cancer people? Only one, and that is HPV16. Bottom line, there are 9 known oncogenic HPV's all but one are not of our concern. There are 5 suspect versions that have yet to be proven oncogenic, but suspect in other anatomical sites (not oral). I just got off the phone will Gillison at JH to confirm that what I am saying is fact.

Rita,
the qoute was right off the CDC website, including the amount estimated for the injections -that is why it is all in qoutes. I merely cut and pasted it.

Since Gardasil had been through all three clinical trial phases it's not actually "new" anymore. It's actually been proven to be safe and efficacious. It was fast tracked through the FDA however so the typical 10 years of clincial data and review are not there but the FDA is watching it closely. The patient sample size was over 21,000 and they had very few adverse reactions.

I would challenge them on the price

Current CDC adverse effects detail: http://www.cdc.gov/vaccinesafety/vaers/gardasil.htm


CDC link for costs:
http://www.cdc.gov/std/HPV/STDFact-HPV-vaccine.htm#hpvvac4

I just re read my post on all this vaccine stuff, and of course I came across harsh (as usual), and I apologize for that. I have this vaccine argument with at least one person a week for over a year now, and I am perhaps tired of it, and tired of the agendas of the anti-vaccine groups that have nothing to do with science.

Most, if not all the medical professional types I have talked to about the vaccine all are in favor of it and have given it to their sons and daughters. All have also told me of the tracking method that follows a patient from the injection and as has been said the major post injection problems are not linked directly to the vaccine but rather it's just that a person that received the vaccine later (say) died. The same would be said about people who ate McDonald's hamburgers if all post McDonald hamburger eating incidents were required to be reported. So a person eats a hamburger from McDonald's and the next day is run over by a car and dies. An internet site will surely pop up and say "people die from eating McDonald's hamburgers" even though the death cert will say death by being run over by a car.

not a problem, Brian. I just decided to shut up on the topic because I was not wanting to argue with anyone over anything and not even wanting to tell anyone not to get it... just voicing my concerns on it when david mentioned it way back when

I guess i am just touchy on it because i have not just read about it but have experienced a problem with my daughter and I hope it has not created a problem for her that will show up later as not being able too have another child, or some other problem above what she has already experienced etc ...

and i got highly irritated when we tried to report her problem (and to inquire as to if this had happened to others) we were told it was not on their list of side effects so they would not even take the report or offer info. well, she is not alone in her problem and had never had such a problem until the shot. periods should not stop for 4 months (then start again and go ok until your next shot and then stop again) ... this worries me. why did it do it and why won't they acknowledge it and what are the true lifelong implications of it ...? i guess only time will tell (which is what i meant by the wait and see before ... wait and see what happens to those who have had it)


But hey I was the one who suggested to her that she get it (probably why her having problems with it bothers me so much)

so no harm done - probably a good time to drop the topic or heck erase all of the posts about it if you wish, wouldn't bother or offend me

have a good one