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#53821 - 03/29/02 01:08 PM alternative/herbal medicines
kathy Offline
Member

Registered: 03/22/02
Posts: 3
Loc: British Columbia, Canada
A good friend of mine has just been diagnosed with cancer of the salivary gland, and his doctor has recommended radiation. He has decided against this procedure and is relying on herbal medicines and prayer to heal him of this disease. Are there any survivors out there who have gone this route and would be willing to share their experiences with him. Since making this decision....the medical profession has not given him any support and basically washed their hands of him. Is there a group discussion that he could join? Thanks for any help and suggestions you might have and good luck to all of you battling this disease....Kathy

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#53823 - 03/29/02 04:26 PM Re: alternative/herbal medicines
Joanna Offline
Patient Advocate (1000+ posts)

Registered: 03/23/02
Posts: 1140
Loc: Pacific Northwest
I must strongly second Brian's opinion. I lost a dear friend to a cancer that need not have killed her. She enriched the proprietors of the health food store, and lost her life. I am a recently diagnosed patient who has found incredibly helpful information here, and at other sites. Please direct your friend to this forum where he can hear, as have I, from those who have gone before in this scary situation.

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#53824 - 03/29/02 05:47 PM Re: alternative/herbal medicines
kathy Offline
Member

Registered: 03/22/02
Posts: 3
Loc: British Columbia, Canada
Thank you both for your excellent answers to my questions...I totally agree with your concerns about my friend...I and many other friends of his have put the same points and arguements forward to him to no avail and have reached a point of realizing all we can do is support his choices. I feel that herbal remedies and prayer should agument radiation....but he beat postate cancer several years ago using these methods and is convinced he can overcome oral cancer without medical intervention as well. In the month since being diagnosed he has been praying, fasting and using his herbal medicines, and the tumour does seems to have shrunk. I found and directed him to this site and he has checked out the messages but is frightened by what he reads here and has asked me to pose these questions for him....I will try to convince him to read more of the messages, I found them so inspirational. Right now though he is looking for a discussion group or forum of Christians who have beaten cancer through prayer, fasting and herbal remedies. Are there any out there??? Thank you to everyone....Kathy

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#53825 - 03/29/02 08:42 PM Re: alternative/herbal medicines
Brian Hill Offline
OCF Founder
Patient Advocate (old timer, 2000 posts)

Registered: 03/18/02
Posts: 4661
Loc: Laguna Niguel, CA
I can't imagine there are enough people alive who have beaten cancer through herbs and prayer, to have a discussion group. I have never seen one anywhere. Certainly I have seen web sites that try to sell you some unregulated herbal remedy, and they have testimonials to go with them. (Which when you try to trace them back to actual people, is impossible) But if there were herbs that cured cancer, don't you think that the hundreds of thousands of people who are afflicted with cancer each year would be buying them and getting cured? Wouldn't it be a major news story? There isn't a miracle cure out there. Only people trying to get rich off of other people's fears and disease. The truth is that when people are desperate, either to avoid a treatment, or to stay alive, they will try anything...believe anything. Unfortunately the world is full of unscrupulous people who prey on these individuals with the herbal "cures" that they sell, or faith healing. There is no peer reviewed medical journal that has endorsed any herbal cure for cancer. At best they can be used in combination with conventional treatments, usually to alleviate some of the problems caused by the treatments themselves. Prayer plays an important role for some. Those with strong religious beliefs find comfort in their faith, and certainly it helps some cope with the disease and its devastation. But when prayer is used in lieu of, (not in conjuction with), treatments with known success, I personally find this direction misguided. As to your friend he needs to embrace a medical path to cure, before the disease becomes so advanced that he can do nothing to reverse it.
_________________________
Brian, stage 4 oral cancer survivor. OCF Founder and Director. The first responsibility of a leader is to define reality. The last is to say thank you. In between, the leader is a servant.

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#53826 - 03/30/02 01:06 PM Re: alternative/herbal medicines
stefon Offline
Contributing Member (25+ posts)

Registered: 03/19/02
Posts: 45
Loc: Lakeville, Minnesota
Kathy,

I underwent cancer surgery in October 2000. My biopsy showed squamous cell carcinoma with a note that said "the neoplasm extends to the surgical margins" or basically, they probably did not get it all. I consider our family to be very religious and we prayed, and continue to pray, a great deal for healing. In conjunction with the prayer, I also knew that my best course of action was to follow my doctor's advice and remove any suspect tissue/bone. I had three teeth and a portion of my upper jaw bone removed, the biopsy of the removed tissue and bone showed no sign of cancer. Do I regret having surgery, no way! I feel that I have done all that I can do to beat this disease. The biopsy of the tissue/bone removed during surgery was not all inclusive so there may have been some cancer cells they did not find, or there may not have been any cancer remaining, It really doesn't matter. I have the peace of mind knowing I've done all that I can do from a spiritual and medical view. I am currently recovering from reconstructive surgery to replace the bone and eventually will have dental implants placed to replace the teeth I lost. I have no regrets, your friend needs to know that the decisions he makes affect not only his life but the lives of all who love and care for him. If he is not willing to seek conventional treatment for himself, maybe he can be convinced to do it for others who need him. Continue to pray and accept the tools offered up in answer to your prayers.

Best of Luck to you and your friend!
_________________________
Stage I diagnosed 9/18/2000

Dave

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#53827 - 03/31/02 02:13 PM Re: alternative/herbal medicines
kathy Offline
Member

Registered: 03/22/02
Posts: 3
Loc: British Columbia, Canada
Thank you Dave for your message...it was greatly appreciated. Unfortunately this friend has taken the stance that he no longer wants any input from anybody that's not a born-again Christian and since I do not fall into that catagory, he will no longer be discussing his health issues with me. I and others are very hurt and concerned about this descision, but for now can have no further input and must stand back and watch and wait for his miraculous healing brought on by prayer, fasting and herbal medicines, alone. My heart is breaking...but he has made it clear that this is the way it will go...stubborn old bachelor that he is. Thank you all for your concern and input, although he has chosen to ignore it, I certainly do appreciate hearing from all of you. My thoughts and good wishes go out to all of you battling this dreaded disease....I lost my dad a few years back to lung cancer, so understand the worry, and heartache brought on by cancer. Godbless you all....Kathy

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#53828 - 09/18/06 11:40 PM Re: alternative/herbal medicines
coverup Offline
Member

Registered: 09/11/06
Posts: 4
Loc: kansas
I just recently came across the message from Kathy about alternative treatments her friend was determined to take. Is that friend still alive? I am a born again Christian as is my suffering and just as determined 33year old daughter. We and hundreds of others have prayed for a year now and they have tried litterally everything "natural". She has now come to the place where she has to decide whether to have radical surgery or die a most excruciating death. Her throat is swelling shut,she cannot talk or eat. Her teeth are falling out from treatment received in Mexico. God has chosen not to heal her but I will say we have seen healing for spiritual issues. Perhaps that is what is most important to God. I do believe though, had she had surgery right away perhaps she would have been able to be a wife and mother to her little family by now. You cannot imagine the agony she is in. Drugs do not phaze it any more-only morphine and they can't seem to get that legally. This week she must decide whether to die or as she says,"have her face cut off". My advice--Pray, accept the prescribed treatment and keep on praying. Thanks for letting me tell this. I hope it will help someone. I have utter confidence that God will be glorified and I will see her in heaven someday. But it has been so very hard on so many of us who love her. Mom

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#53829 - 09/19/06 09:23 PM Re: alternative/herbal medicines
Brian Hill Offline
OCF Founder
Patient Advocate (old timer, 2000 posts)

Registered: 03/18/02
Posts: 4661
Loc: Laguna Niguel, CA
I respect your right to believe in any manner. I hope that your confidence in what the future holds brings you some inner peace. I read your earlier postings and realize what a horrible experience your family is going through. But I still cannot understand the willingness of individuals to abandon what we have learned over thousands of years about illness and healing, to decide not to apply the knowledge that has been learned through trial end error, or even in the eyes of some, gained through the grace of a higher being's desire to see us have that knowledge, and put it to practical use. Fear of treatments is often stronger than fear of the disease in its early stages, when it is not so painful or disfiguring.

Whatever became of Kathy's friend is unknown since she never came back to tell us, and no surviving friend of hers returned to tell others about his success that they may follow in his footsteps. Given the many people that I have talked with on the phone about similar issues over the last 5 years, and the inevitable results that befell them, I suspect there is no survivor to come back and talk to us.

I have lost count of the conversations I have has like these, and because of my own frustration with these senseless deaths, I no longer take calls from people convinced that God will save them (without the aid of medical persons and techniques that he was perhaps involved in revealing to a world certainly in need of them) or that He wishes them to end their earthly life long before their time. In matters of faith, reason has little place it seems. I have too much to deal with - dealing with those people (also) of strong religious beliefs that believe that (a) God wants them to use every tool that he (perhaps) provided to them to work through the difficult choices and live on to inspire others, and be with their loved ones.

I have stated in previous posts and in the FAQ's.... there are no treatments in Mexico that have proven to save people from cancer when looked at by any body of independent people. The only thing that happens is that the families are drained of any financial resources they have, and then when there is nothing more to be gained from them, they are left by those who promised them that they had an answer/cure to their problem.
_________________________
Brian, stage 4 oral cancer survivor. OCF Founder and Director. The first responsibility of a leader is to define reality. The last is to say thank you. In between, the leader is a servant.

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#53830 - 09/20/06 07:32 AM Re: alternative/herbal medicines
Gary Offline
Administrator, Resident radiation science expert
Patient Advocate (old timer, 2000 posts)

Registered: 11/27/02
Posts: 3536
Loc: San Francisco CA
Coverup,
I'm a "born again" Christian (I hate that term - I "rediscovered" Christianity in 1989 after 25 years as an agnostic and former Catholic - I am a non denominational Christian in an evangelical style church today). I had faith that my medical team would cure me and prayed often for wisdom for them. I also had many people praying for me.

I have been "hands on" involved in ministry for many years - LCT "Lay Christian Counseling", substance abuse/recovery ministry and the Praise and Worship music team.

Throughout the scriptures many unlikely people were used by God for many purposes, Judas Iscariot (the betrayer), the Apostle Paul (who was a despised tax collector) just to name a few. We are commanded in the scriptures to submit to authorities (that can include doctors). To forgo conventional medical treatment and use practically "new age" treatments are sinful in their own right. We are commanded to take care of our bodies as they are temples of the Holy Spirit. It is suicidal and delusional to do otherwise. By the way, I am the only one who didn't die from cancer that the prayer team at my church was praying for. Was it prayer that kept me alive? I really believe the fact I went to a comprehensive cancer center and sought the best doctors on the planet were what kept me alive. Some members of my medical team were devout Christians.

Jesus performed many healing and deliverance miracles during His ministry on earth but they all had one thing in common - they were used for example, teaching and outreach to the masses. Can you think of any instances where the Apostles achieved physical healing during their ministries? I think not. Even Paul couldn't get physical healing from God - see the links below.

See this article from the Christian Research Institute for more on physical healing: http://www.iclnet.org/pub/resources/text/cri/cri-nwsl/web/crn0064a.html

Another persepective on "healing": http://www.surfinthespirit.com/healthy-living/healing.html


More information on "altermative cures" from a Christian perspective:

http://www.surfinthespirit.com/healthy-living/alternative-med.html

Footnote: I apologize for breaking the rule about posting links in this thread and topic but the Christians here need to have a balanced and biblical perspective on these issues. I apologize also to non Christians and people of other faiths or belief systems. It is atypical for me to intermingle cancer and religion but in this instance I felt compelled to make an exception and the thread had clearly taken on religious overtones.
_________________________
Gary Allsebrook
***********************************
Dx 11/22/02, SCC, 6 x 3 cm Polypoid tumor, rt tonsil, Stage III/IVA, T3N0M0 G1/2
Tx 1/28/03 - 3/19/03, Cisplatin ct x2, IMRT, bilateral, with boost, x35(69.96Gy)
________________________________________________________
"You are a mist that appears for a little while and then vanishes" (James 4:14 NIV)

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#53831 - 09/20/06 11:07 PM Re: alternative/herbal medicines
JAM Offline
Patient Advocate (old timer, 2000 posts)

Registered: 04/01/05
Posts: 2676
Loc: Arkansas
Brian and Gary, what thought provoking and to the point posts. Thanks for an interesting read- and I, for one, will continue to think about and process your words. Amy
_________________________
CGtoJohn:SCC Flr of Mouth.Dx 3\05. Surg.4\05.T3NOMO.IMRTx30. Recur Dx 1\06.Surg 2\06. Chemo: 4 Cycles of Carbo\Taxol:on Erbitux for 7 mo. Lost our battle 2-23-07- But not the will to fight this disease

:

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