PerioSciences has several dry mouth products. I was in a study for a few weeks and found their AO ProVantage gel to provide good moisture from the lips to almost the back of the mouth. They have offered a small travel sized bottle for $12, 50% off retail through the end of the year if anyone is interested. It would last 3-4 weeks if you want to try their products. You can Google their website and see the Hydrating product line as well as their other products.

If you are interested (after review of their ingredients of course) let me know and I will provide the phone number to call for this promotion and the promotion code. If you are in the Dallas area, you can sign up for the ongoing study with the Dental Onco that supports OCF.

Ed

Hey Ed,

Now, with my first clear scan in the rear view mirror, I'm now pondering the subject of keeping my teeth healthy long term and doing some research to that end.

So far my research has involved speaking with my dentist and oral surgeon and received familiar recommendations of fluoride trays, thorough brushing, etc. General wisdom is that bacteria feeds the decay and cavities.

To date, my focus and goal has been on finding ways to keep bacteria growth to a minimum all the time, period. My approach, beyond regular brushing and such is to find something I can keep in my mouth that would release antibacterial agent throughout the day.

Maybe a non sugar type of hard "candy" that slowly released this stuff yet tasted alright. Then I thought of the Listerine label boldly stating it kills all bacteria. That got me thinking about just keeping some mouthwash around and doing a quick swish and spit every hour. Then I saw this post.

PerioScience recognizes antibacterial benefit buts follows the science that antioxidants offer similar if not better benefit.

As a complete dummy in chemistry much less how the mouth and cavity and tooth decay really work, I stand at the fork in the road scratching my head which way to go.

First, dry mouth during waking hours is not a symptom I need to address; only occasionally during sleep does it create a problem.

Going down the antibacterial path, it seems just mixing up some alcohol and hydrogen peroxide and giving that a swish and spit could work pretty well during the day. I might also search out some antibacterial "mints" or something to suck on that would give protections against bacterial formation. Going down the antioxidant route, PerioScience has product as you have presented.

I've not seen much discussed on oral care beyond the cursory and obligatory suggestions. It would be great to get into a deeper understanding of how to ensure healthy teeth over the long term.

Thanks
Don

Looking over their site a bit more, it is pretty light on details. Under team, it seems a pretty motley crew to be selling a medicinal product. Almost laughable is they list not a single certified medical professional. The CEO touts this is his third startup. Humm.... maybe antibacterial is a more prudent path.

donfo,

I've recently posted on this topic, under Long-Term physical and QOL Issues section of the forum.

Hi Lottie,

I took a good look for similar topic and did not find any similar for using something that would act as an ongoing source to combat bacteria formation. This is besides use of fluoride trays and pastes and flossing and waterpiks and such.

Don, I have the same preoccupation with keeping my teeth as healthy as possible. In terms of keeping acid under control in the mouth, I take soda bicarbonate mouthwash (0.5 teaspoon to 250 mls water)in a plastic bottle around with me and rinse after eating/drinking.(I also ingest a small amount occasionally when I have heartburn, which works well) It is cheap and easily obtained. I also floss every night. Best done before bed as apparently bacteria do their worst damage over night, possibly because there is less saliva around to help protect the teeth. My dentist is very happy with my teeth saying there is no signs of plaque build up. Sally

Don, I spent a bit of time out your way during the dotcom buzz. You sound like you have tad of dotcom fever lingering. I'm not as concerned with the credentials of the people as I am the science behind the product. I'll review everything and, usually, if it's not something harmful, I will try it. It's easy to find ways to try and lot of things that may help. Even if something helps one, it may not help someone else. With such limited resources available it is important we all seek out any assistive devices, ideas, etc. that may provide comfort or convenience for any of us. Throw enough at the wall, something may stick. Just remember to move the couch away from the wall.

As a Finance and IT exec, I appreciate your diligence. I would not grant them credit nor would I invest in them.

Ed

@saxicola

Over here it is better known as baking soda. I just checked my box of Arm and Hammer "pure" baking soda and it contains 100% sodium bicarbonate, so we are talking about the same thing.

This chemical is alkaline so it will reduce acid so the idea is cavities grow in acid environments. If that is the case then it makes common sense, not necessarily scientific and practical sense, keeping one's mouth at a higher pH level would be preferred.

During treatments when my mouth was just full of sores, ulcers, and pain, I found high alkaline bottled water (pH 9+) that worked well. Maybe this is all one needs. Similar to what you are doing in principle.

I did experiment with trying to increase my tap water to similar pH levels and found it very hard to do with baking soda. By the time I got it up enough it took on a quite noticable off taste. I think it was the buffering that actually changed to feel of the water. I gave up at that point and went back to the bottled version; on sale, not a bad price.

Maybe we are onto something! Keep the ideas flowing.
Don

Here is a quote from Wikipedia, so caution applies as usual.
Personal hygiene[edit]
Toothpaste containing sodium bicarbonate has in several studies shown to have a better whitening[29][29][30][31] and plaque removal effect[32][33] than toothpastes without it.
Sodium bicarbonate is also used as an ingredient in some mouthwashes. It has anti-caries and abrasive properties.[34] It works as a mechanical cleanser on the teeth and gums, neutralizes the production of acid in the mouth and also acts as an antiseptic to help prevent infections.[citation needed]
Sodium bicarbonate in combination with other ingredients can be used to make a dry or wet deodorant.[35][36] It may also be used as a shampoo.[37]
Sodium bicarbonate may be used as a buffering agent, combined with table salt, when creating a solution for nasal irrigation.[38]

@Ed,

After I posted my thoughts I wondered if you would take my post in the spirit I meant and not one to just be slamming you for offering your discovery. As we have a similar DNA and cultural identity, I figured you understood my point. Having similar tech backgrounds, critical thinking and problem solving built in also helps. Thanks.

The theory goes oxidative stress is linked to periodontal disease and antioxidants reduce oxidative stress so less cavities, etc. Free radicals increase oxidative stress.

Now, they need to show the research bears this out. I researched their site. Under the Science tab there are three sub tabs. All information reported as science was prepared by one individual and there are no links to the papers, just abstracts at best.

A couple other interesting facts. They mention a chemist is running their research lab but this person is not identified. It might be implied as the author of the mentioned papers but not explicitly stated.

Another observation is the papers and presentations were produced very close together and then nothing. One would assume if this was promising there would be more research and results published. One reasonable conclusion is the theory was not accepted by peers and thus sort of died out.

If you have a sample, what are the ingredients as nothing detailed is listed on the website? Maybe we can do a bit more investigation as to what might be the active processes here.

Here is a paper describing some info on antioxidants in general. I'd "invest" in this one. :-) I can sleep well with this one tucked into my sheets.

http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/antioxidants/

Going down another path is the idea of free radicals. Supposedly they are bad so reducing them is a good idea. This article relates electrons and free radicals. Free radicals eat electrons. Antioxidants are a form of electron donor which is supposed to reduce to harmful effects of the free radicals.

The other post is about alkaline water to maybe help reduce cavities. What I found marketed along with the high pH on the bottled water was the use of the term electrolytes. Sounds kind of similar but I have no idea what relationship electrolytes have to being considered an electron donor. I'll pursue this a bit more.

IF, and a big if, the electrolytes are a electron donor to help fight free radicals and the alkalinity fights the bacteria growth, we just might be onto something that is fighting on both fronts.

Don

Don, it's all good.

I lean towards polyphenols as antioxidants and ferulic acid and phloretin are both polyphenols. Probably the finest sencha or gyokuro green tea would provide many times more polyphenols than any toothpaste. Keep in mind any pH adjustment in the mouth is going to be like taste...it will last till the next thing you put in your mouth.

Just so you know, the dentist that asked me to participate in the study supports OCF, was featured in a recent SPOHNC newsletter and my wife works in rad onc in the largest cancer center here in Dallas and has known the dentist for a quite a while. I gave him a pass because of the referential credibility!

Focus on regular cleaning and excellent hygiene and minimal sugar till things settle.

Mondai wa arimasen. Daijoubu desu.

Ed