After all the hell we ALL went through during treatment, my husband is drinking again. He survived Stage IV HPV positive oral cancer and must think he's invincible. I can't take this. I'm thinking about leaving him. He just had his second clean scan. The doctor even told him that he must not drink because there isn't enough data to know if the alcohol could have been a contributing factor in his cancer.
Hi Believe,
I see you made others posts but this is the first one I read. I apologize in advance if I ask a question you have already discusses.
First, I'm sorry for your frustration. You mentioned that you are thinking of leaving him. How long have you been married? Is your husband the type of man you can talk to? Has he explained his reason for drinking? Does he drink a lot? Sorry for all of the questions, I'm just trying to see the bigger picture.
The docs do say oral cancer and drinking do not go together. None of us should be drinking in excess. I will have a glass of red wine sometimes but that's about it.
I hope we can help you through this.
How much does he drink?
What does he drink?
How old is he?
Actually leaving him might just be the worse thing you could do for him, cancer-wise.
We've been together for 11 years. He always drank heavily and his drink is VODKA. He was sober during treatment and during recovery but now he is back at it. I've talked with him. He said that he isn't ready to give it up. George is 52. He doesn't drink every night but when he does drink, he drinks enough to "tie one on." Said that he doesn't see the point in stopping since it probably wasn't what caused it (HPV positive). It was hell for him, for me, our family. I am exhausted and frustrated. It is such a slap in the face for me that, after all we went through together, he would choose this?! He knows it worries me but says that it "shouldn't." I liken it to playing russian roulette. I don't want to be there when the gun goes off. I'm angry. Please help.
Hi, Believe -
I'm so sorry for this additional stress of your husband's problem drinking and his denial. My dad was an alcoholic - he stopped drinking before he developed his cancers, but everyone was convinced that heavy drinking and smoking caused them.
Whether your husband is an alcoholic, or not, the best thing you can do is to get yourself to an Alanon meeting to help you deal with this. You have to realize that it's his problem, not yours - the change has to come from him; you can't force it. At this point, he's not ready to change.
My husband also had a problem with drinking. I attended a few Alanon meetings without his knowing - he never found out. It helped me and my attitude toward him, and eventually, our relationship.
I know it's hard to not separate his cancer, all you've gone through, and his drinking, but they are different issues. Staying sober during treatment didn't guarantee he would remain sober permanently, unfortunately. I wish you luck because it's not easy to live with someone who travels the path of self destruction.
Good luck - you certainly need it.
Marlene
You can't force him to change; he has to want to. The only thing you can change is how you react to/deal with his behavior. Al-Anon can be very, very helpful in that regard.
Hi
my husband drank before,during and after his cancer,the doctors here were in no doubt that his alchohol use contributed to his cancer,but it didn't stop him nothing could,no pleading,no begging,not leaving him,he didnt want to stop so he didn't.Believe me i know what that feels like as a carer,but he is an adult and you can't force him to realise what a totally selfish person he is being after all the time and effort invested in his care it seems so ungrateful doesn't it?
I second all the advice to get help for yourself. I often wanted to but never did. My husband stopped drinking shortly before his first surgery but still ended up with the DT's while in the SICU. This complicated his recovery and he had to be given drugs to stop the shakes adding additional days to his hospital stay. He never really drank after that because his mouth was too sore. It was a shame to see the wonderful man that he had kept hidden by the booze too late. He had such incredible srength till the end and I wish he would have realized that he didn't need the alcohol to be an amzazing person. Get help for yourself-they may be able to help you help him.
I'd be pissed off too, it is a slap in the face. I couldn't deal with this alone, I would have to go outside for help.
I'll be thinking of you!
Believe,
Since too little is known about the how's and why's of HPV most lab docs believe that there is a co factor that may contribute to HPV infecting the cell and since alcohol is known to cause cellular damage it may well be a co factor in the HPV process.
It is also now thought that we may reacquire HPV multiple times throughout our life and it's not even known if the radiation kills all the HPV in our oral cavity during Tx. So if you combine the fact the he may reacquire (or never got rid of) HPV and alcohol may have contributed to his cancer in the first place then he may well be providing the same formula for disaster that originally was present.
As others have said if he's addicted he must be the one that says I HAVE A PROBLEM.
Hi Laurie, so sorry to hear of your situation. Don't really know what to say but wanted to let you you know that others have been in the same situation. Can't agree more with the other people that responded suggesting seeking Al-Anon or some other support group. I think my biggest advice would be to try to seperate the two issues, the one being caring for someone that is battling cancer and the other living with and caring for an alcoholic. If his drinking was a problem before finding out about cancer, his drinking after treatment is still a problem that should probably be dealt with. Even if alcohol is not attributing to his problems with cancer, it is still contributing to other health issues that may not have appeared yet. I will get off my soapbox and send whatever strength I can your way.
Believe,
It is extremely frustrating and saddening to be in your situation, but I do see some bit of hope...your husband did stop drinking during treatment and while in recovery, as you mentioned. To me that indicates that there is still an ounce of willingness on his part to stop drinking when he should, although I understand that the circumstances were very different during that period when he did stop drinking. So perhaps a lot more reinforcement on him about the fact that alcohol was a big factor leading to his cancer could help (I know, easier said than done).
I was a non-smoker. And like your husband, I didn't drink everyday but was a heavy drinker during occassions when I did (as my colleagues and friends could attest)...and I also took / preferred hard liquor over beer: vodka, whisky, tequila, gin, rhum. When I realized that 1 of 2 major reasons for causing my cancer is NOT what I had or did, then it must be the other reason. I haven't had a drop of alcohol since my Dx nine months ago.
I also agree with the advice to get outside help for yourself.
Good luck, wishing you success in this new challeng you're facing.
Jojo
Jojo,
Where was your primary?
David,
Mobile tongue. Started on left side, tumor grew inwards toward the middle part in less than 3 months (my estimate, from the time that it started out as what I thought was a small, insignificant, normal and easily-cureable blister). About 90% of my tongue was removed, replaced with a flap permanently anchored to the floor of my mouth.
Jojo
Thank you all for your responses. I feel like I could just scream. Tomorrow is the sixth anniversary of my Dad's passing from SCC Stage III, total glossectomy. My Dad is gone, my husband saw it happen, lived it himself and still wants to drink. UGH. Death wish? I don't know. I'll get myself to a meeting. Thank you for your support. Warmly, Laurie
Hi, Laurie. Maybe reading him Liz's (cookie) signature line will put a bit of fear in him. Though I must admit I still like a drink of tequila after work, drinking enough to "tie one on" is not a good thing for anyone. Sorry Liz, but if Robin's story can make Laurie's husband just stop and think for a second, well, that's something.
David
dont ever be sorry for holding Robin up as an example of what not to do,and if his story scares the bejesus out of anyone who thinks its ok to smoke and drink after a diagnosis of Oral Cancer then all well and good.I have said a hundred times that the whole reason for staying on these boards is to give some point to Robs death.Hopefully our experience will help others fighting the same demons,and my experiences will benfit other carers riding the same bus.
There was another poster whose husband was dying and she posted some very moving comments about how he tried to smoke even when the filter would get saturated with blood as soon as he put the cigarette into his mouth. I printed that blog out and gave it to my smoking employees but now I can't find it.
Sounds like Riches plea i think David of course i may be wrong and you will of course correct me(you know how much i like correction) xx
Yes that's the one. Julie, Rich's wife, wrote this in Nov 29, 2007. One of, if not THE most powerful posts I ever read.
Rich asked me to write this and get as many people to read it as possible. I know here I'm probably preaching to the choir but here it is anyway.
My husband is 60 years old and is dying of oral cancer. We have been married for 27 years. I`m 46 years old and have been smoking since I was 14 years old.
Let me tell you about that long miserable death you may be facing if you cont. to smoke. My husband is slowly going though it right now. He has oral cancer. The treatment recommended involved a 12 hour operation to remove most of his tongue and the lymph nodes in his neck. They would have taken a flap of muscle from his arm to rebuilt his tongue and neck. After the surgery they wanted to do radiation every weekday for 6 weeks plus chemo. He would have had a tube to breathe though and be fed though a tube. All of this would have given him a 20 percent chance of surviving for 5 years. This would have dropped to less than 5 if he cont. to smoke.
However due to other damage from his 45 year habit this is out of the question. When he went to a cardiologist to get clearance for the surgery he found out due to smoking he would need heart bypass surgery first to even be considered a candidate for the surgery for the cancer. He decided not to do it.
So now he is receiving hospice care. The cancer in his mouth is growing. He has difficulty talking, eating and is on major painkillers than don`t always work. He can`t close his mouth and is constantly drooling. I could go on but I think you get the idea.
This is what convinced me to quit. Smoking is not worth it!
Update on Rich. 9/4
We have been told the end is near. 2 hours to 2 weeks. possibly by bleeding to death. The cancer had broken though a vein once and will soon break though an artery. If that happens it won`t stop.
update on Rich 10/7
Its over a month since the doc said 2 hours to 2 weeks. He has had 4 more episodes of profuse bleeding. The tumor in his mouth is now breaking through the skin on the bottom on his chin.
Update on Rich 11/15
His face is horribly disfigured now. The tumor under his chin is protuding about 3 inchs and is about 4 inchs around. It has a few open areas that seep blood. The whole thing is scabbed over and black in color. He also has a large tumor on the lymph node on his neck. This is by his carotid artery. This is the one they say may be causing the personality change by blocking the bloodflow to his brain. This horrible disease is turning him into someone I don`t know.
Update on Rich 11/21
Yesterday everytime he attempted to swallow he bleed a little. Got his pain meds switched to a patch. He is unable to eat or drink at this point, Then he woke up from a nap bleeding profusely. Had to pack his mouth with surigel. He really isn`t himself anymore and is verbally abusive. At least with his mouth packed he was unable to talk. (gotta laugh whenever possible )
Update on Rich 11/26
The tumor on his neck bleeds profusely each time the bandage is changed. He is alert and aware and very scared when this happens. I can usually get it under control pretty rapidly but sometimes its not so rapid. Yesterday he insisted I get the hospice nurse to do it cuz I just didn`t know what I was doing. The on call hospice nurse came , it bled profusely she passed out and I had to get it under control. He told me how much he loved and appreciated me then:) He has not smoked since the 21st. He attempted to smoke that day with blood pouring out of his mouth, he couldn`t do it and i guess looking at the bloody cig finally turned off the desire.
Update 11/29
His mouth is just one big sore now, He is unable to even take the Roxanol for the pain. This is morphine that you just put in your mouth and it is absorbed. No need to swallow but not meant to be put on an open sore.His pain level is `between an 8 and a 9` Since he remains at home they do not provide shots. We are waiting on morphine gel athat is given by rubbing it into the wrist. He is only taking sips of fluids and eating ice cream for the last few days. Since we got a humidifier he hasn`t bled when he swallowed.
Her post went on for 6 more pages but by early Dec Rich was "sleeping" 20 hours a day and he passed away Jan 4th, 2008.
How horrible for that poor man.....what an awful way to die. You're right David, that is a very POWERFUL post.
Shelley
I remember seeing this before and I just can't look at it again. If this doesn't make someone stop I don't what will....I just don't.
Laurie -
I'm glad you will get help for yourself. Hang in there and be strong for yourself.
Marlene
Thhis is the typew of post I enjoy reading. Not enjoy, but need to read and do whenever I get the chance. It sure puts the reallity at the end of your nose so that you see it very clearly and understand it much better. Thanks all.
Hi Jim:) Nice to see a post from you. I know it's hard for you ti sit in front of the computer...hope you know I'm one of your angles and I'm always thinking of you:) It's funny..I was telling my sister about you the other day and I said "my friend from OCF" It kind of makes me laugh that we are "friends" and we never met:)